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lrdb question+new line question

If I -know- there is no lrdb for the artist or the song, is lrdb on artistfooter still unknown? or is it no?

Can I somehow get a <br /> button on the toolbox for editions? — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sscout (talkcontribs).

If a parameter is not applicable, then you change the "unknown" on the talk page to "not applicable". Though, since the lrcDB parameter was added only recently to ArtistFooter, there is no corresponding parameter in the Artist Info template available yet. (And, since this would be "n/a" for most artists anyway, we're not sure whether we should add one…)
Those edit buttons are site-wide, I don't think they can be customised per user. Most of the time, <br>s are unnecessary anyway; to start a new paragraph, you just have to add a blank line (see above). — 6x9 (Talk) 03:14, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

About lrdb, how about setting it to "not yet" (i.e. so people interested can go to lrdb and make one, instead of just wondering when it will be added) --  Sscout    talk    contribs    ♫   21:01, 3 April 2009 (UTC) (and, am I really the only one that likes those colours?)

You can go ahead and add "timed = done" or "timed = not applicable" to the {{Artist Info}} template on the talk page, even if it produces no visible result (yet). (For some reason "timed" rather than "lrcDB" was chosen for the parameter in {{Song Info}}, so the same will have to be used for {{Artist Info}}…) Between all those gaudy, colourful signatures a spot of grey is really refreshing :-)6x9 (Talk) 21:14, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
It is refreshing!
So I just added ASYN to Just Dance, can I move it to bronze/silver even without TIMED? --  Sscout    talk    contribs    ♫   21:57, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
It could have gone Bronze even before that, the requirements for that are relatively lax. lrcDB isn't required for Silver, just for Gold. I just checked and changed it to "not applicable", so the only thing missing for the song to go Gold is a certificate. — 6x9 (Talk) 22:05, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

This is kind of embarrassing but I just can't find it, where is a list of colours? or since I've seen them on span's, do I just use a list off the web? :P --  Sscout    talk    contribs    ♫   22:11, 3 April 2009 (UTC) P.S. I mean those colors Color and CSS not the hex color codes :P

Here is a list, for example. You get more diversity with hex values, though they do take a bit of trial-and-error :-) — 6x9 (Talk) 22:18, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
So line breaks inside SPAN's are respected? --  Sscout    talk    contribs    ♫   22:35, 3 April 2009 (UTC)
Yes, span tags change just the bits you want them to and leave everything else as usual. (Which is pretty neat, actually, since it means that you can wrap them around more or less everything.) — 6x9 (Talk) 22:40, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Can you take a quick look at Sean's talk page? I left a message there about referencing Category:Genre/J-Pop, but maybe I'm just doing something wrong? --  Sscout    talk    contribs    ♫   23:13, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Evidently I did something wrong (again) why does {{Template:Sscoutwelcome}} not work to give someone a welcome? (and please give one to Engage :P --  Sscout    talk    contribs       02:32, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Ah of course, it's not {{Template:Sscoutwelcome}}, it's {{Template:SscoutWelcome}} gah... --  Sscout    talk    contribs       02:35, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
....................................................... First half of my reply used to be there, but you solved that bit yourself :-) Oh, and for "real" templates (the ones starting with "Template:") you don't have to use the full pagename, only the bit after the colon – so just inserting {{SscoutWelcome}} on a talk page is enough. — 6x9 (Talk) 02:43, 5 April 2009 (UTC)


Why did you reverted [[Activ:Lucruri simple]] back to Activ:Lucruri Simple? Romanian, similarily with many other languages but contrary to English, does not capitalise all letters in the title. 22:59, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

See LW:PN. In short: since most languages have different capitalisation rules, we've simplified things by requiring that the first letter of each word has to be capitalised. — 6x9 (Talk) 23:13, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Requesting your input

Please see the discussion at LyricWiki_talk:Community_Portal#Poetry_on_CD. Thanks,    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   22:29, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

In light of the overwhelming (for Community Portal) consensus that poetry not be allowed on LW, are you going to delete Alix Olson:Sticks? --    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   13:21, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
Probably, yes (well, me or another admin). Let's give it a bit more time, though – the topic isn't even a day old! (BTW, the C.P. is on my watchlist, and I usually manage to keep up with it, so unless it's a pressing issue, you don't have to alert me personally. I promise I'll get to see it anyway!) — 6x9 (Talk) 14:32, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
Thank you and watchlist comment duly noted. (hiding my face in embarrassment) Embarrassed You, Red, Echo and others see just about everything, I know. I guess I was a bit overzealous for a reply to my post. Rainbow Your page needed more colour! --    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   14:51, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Check this artist page

Bunchofuckingoofs - Formatting is messed up! --    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   00:04, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

YEAH, I'D SEEN THAT. I'VE DONE WHAT I COULD. UNFORTUN oops, sorry… Unfortunately, the song pages don't look much better. I started to correct them earlier, but lost the will to live motivation after a few. — 6x9 (Talk) 00:35, 5 April 2009 (UTC)
You know, I am itching to slap a ban on anyone who posts ALLCAPS pages....arghhhh ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 13:39, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks on labels

So changing everything to labels should eliminate false results on artists missing label? --  Sscout    talk    contribs       02:40, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Yep, as long as the {{Labels}} template appears somewhere above the ArtistFooter. (That's one of the limitations, unfortunately – a template can only use information that has been provided somewhere above on the same page.) — 6x9 (Talk) 02:48, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
(a comma & a space (also removed myself from the "thanks to" line - didn't seem quite appropriate, as Sean is the creator of this site!)) <-- I meant, thanks to you for letting me rip off your Welcome :P BTW, how's the new sig? --  Sscout    talk    contribs       02:50, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
Definitely better than the green/orange thing :-) You might want to change "Light Gray" to hex code, though – not all browsers support it. (At least my IE6 doesn't, it displays a white background instead.) (And aren't templates meant to be ripped off?) — 6x9 (Talk) 02:56, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Hard translations


I just translated a song, but I feel quite uneasy. I'm not unhappy about the translation, it's just that the song was somehow poetical and some of the words were carefully used (or maybe they just seem like they were). So I now translated it just for the purpose that people know what the song says. (Example: I translated "Bitteschön, Dankeschön" as "Here you go, Thanks a lot", but I could also have translated this as "Here you go, there you go", in order to maintain the "beauty" of the language and the deeper sense of the song, because these two words have nothing to do with the rest of the text; it's also that "Bitteschön, Dankeschön" represents the catchword contact of daily life, so maybe the other way would have been better).

I was working on a template for such cases, but it got quite difficult. Don't know if it's because of me or the topic. Here's what I had so far:

<includeonly><table style="width:100%; clear:both; background-color:#FBFBEA; border:2px solid #E2E39C; margin:1em 0em"><tr><td style="vertical-align=center; padding:0 0.5em">[[Image:Khelpcenter.png|32px]]</td><td style="width:100%; vertical-align:center">You may not believe it, but the songs of '''{{{1|{{ARTIST}}}}}''' are more poetical as you may believe!<br>Thus, it's not quite easy to translate the songs. The translations of this songs are therefore either not very accurate ''or'' understandable, because the original beauty of the language was tried to be preserved (sometimes this depends on the translator).</td></tr></table></includeonly><noinclude> You can use this template if you translated a song which was difficult to translate (for example if it was very poetical and the translation is very funny because you tried to preserve the "beauty" of the original language). It's actually hard to explain, when you can use it and when not, it's very optional, only use it, when you got the feeling. <nowiki>

I also stopped, because I don't know whether that's a good idea or not. Or it doesn't matter at all. Or if it could be included in the usual TransInfo-Template.

Sorry bout whining and how this entry is written (it's really hard to me to structure my thoughts).--KaputteMenschen 19:27, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

I understand what you mean. And it's the main reason why I don't do translations – I'd get so bogged down with details I'd never make it past the first line… I don't think a generic Infobox template would help much; that a translation is also necessarily an interpretation should be pretty clear anyway. So the best bet would be to add annotations to the translation, like this:
some translated text <sup>[[#Notes|1]]</sup>
some more translated text <sup>[[#Notes|2]]</sup>
# first annotation
# second annotation
Sorry I can't be of any more help. — 6x9 (Talk) 20:29, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Page mover vandal strikes again

6x9, see Recent changes. Thanks,    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   21:13, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Song with [ ]s in the title


On this album there seems to be an error with the 29th song. I tried the nowiki-tags around the brackets in the song title and HTML-Entites, but it doesn't work. How are they (the square brackets) actually escaped?--KaputteMenschen 22:24, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Square brackets can't be used in pagenames at all, it's a technical restriction. You'll have to replace them with round brackets (). For the display part of the link, you can use the HTML codes &#91; and &#93;. Have a look now; I've fixed the links. — 6x9 (Talk) 22:32, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
Sorry to horn in on the conversation, but for the display, you don't even need to correct with html code. See the following link: Main Page [English]. --WillMak050389 22:40, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
Right, sorry. I confused that with external links, where square brackets produce odd-looking results. — 6x9 (Talk) 22:43, 8 April 2009 (UTC)


I've lied on this page. Could you turn it into truth please. I could probably suss it but I've kinda had enough for now. I need template to take into account sub-pages i.e. LyricWiki talk:Administrators Portal/TEMPLATES. Thank you.  Яєdxx Actions Words 22:25, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Fixed. Had to add another parameter for that, though, as reliable autodetection would depend on all archive pages having the same name format, i.e. basepage/Archive/####. — 6x9 (Talk) 23:00, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks I had to fix the first part of template but done now.  Яєdxx Actions Words 23:14, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
Just testing whether you'd notice ;-) — 6x9 (Talk) 23:16, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
I might get as good as you yet..perhaps I should not talk to you more often ;) Actually, I started doing all this sorting Archives thing as you seem to archive stuff in Community Portal and Admin Portal, they needed sorting and I wanted to help you. I guess I should really update every link now, but.. Яєdxx Actions Words 02:47, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for that. The previous naming format was a pain, unless you wanted to wait for the pages to get really oooge and then archive everything at once. — 6x9 (Talk) 12:39, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
Well although it took a while, I figured it would only need doing once and then it should be a sinch to pick up and maintain. As such that it was worth spending time on. I decided on where one archive ended and another began according to page size. You'll find that most are now less than the 32. (I only really hit a problem with year ends).  Яєdxx Actions Words 17:07, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
"sinch"? s and c aren't even next to each other on the keyboard… I never bothered about page size much, really – even IE6 has no trouble with 100kb pages, and archives aren't for editing anyway. And even if someone using Windows 3.1 (ah, the good old days, when you could still exit to DOS) needed to edit something, there'd still be the section edit links… — 6x9 (Talk) 18:51, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
Exiting to DOS...I was once told I should learn DOS but I never needed to. First PC I had was Windows 98.  Яєdxx Actions Words 00:17, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
There's still a lot of things (file operations, mostly) a DOS box lets you do that Windows Explorer can't (at least not without some external program), thanks to wildcards. — 6x9 (Talk) 00:36, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Wrong Album Artist?

I can't figure out what is wrong with this page [[Dum Dums:Album Two Demos (Unreleased)]], it insists on showing it as being 'various artists' instead of 'Dum Dums'. Thanks for your time. -- Ezekiel000

It's because of the pagename – for albums the format needs to be "Artist:Title (YEAR)". In the case of unreleased demos you can use the year of recording, if that isn't known, you'll have to use "(????)" instead. I'd also drop the "(Unreleased)" from the pagename, but that's a matter of taste (since there's no official title really). — 6x9 (Talk) 22:38, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks, I hadn't realised that the year mattered for that. -- Ezekiel000

If you wonder why you are getting more traffic

...don't assume it's because of your natural charm and good looks, because I actually feel it has more to do with this. Rflmao. Perhaps he thought you could do with the practice ;) *Still laughing*  Яєdxx Actions Words 16:08, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Think you're telling me something new? Then look at its edit history. — 6x9 (Talk) 16:09, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Song credits links?

Should all names in song credits be links? I didn't see anything in the help or actually any reason to do this.

Reference: -- Ezekiel000

Not necessarily. If there's a LW page for the artist, then a link is usually a good idea (unless it's the same artist as in the {{Song}} template, in which case a link would be redundant). I guess for Gold songs it is kind-of implicitly required by the blanket "all available information is present" statement, but it's no big deal if you don't add a link. — 6x9 (Talk) 16:57, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks. -- Ezekiel000

Page Ranking?

I'm a bit confused about page ranking, I've read through the help pages I've found on it. Am I meant to change the rank my self or is it done by someone else? What happens if a song or album isn't sold on iTunes/Amazon or there's no video can the page still get a gold rank?

I'm looking after the Josh Doyle, Dum Dums, Semisonic, The Bluetones, Harvey Danger pages and I keep an eye on the Ocean colour scene pages but I think someone else is looking after them. And I think I've got them into okay order. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ezekiel000 (talkcontribs).

Any user can change the rank. If something isn't available on Amazon, you change the "asin" parameter in the ranking template (on the talk page) to "not applicable". For a page to go Gold, no parameter must be "unknown", they can, however, be "not applicable". (That question crops up fairly often… I suppose it's time to improve the help pages!) Hope that helps!
PS. Please sign your posts by adding -- ~~~~. Thanks! — 6x9 (Talk) 16:50, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
I had a go at completing a song to gold rank but "not applicable" didn't work, I got some weird results in the links at the bottom of the page. If you have time could you check this one 7 Year Itch before I start doing more making mistakes and getting myself banned. — Ezekiel000
Thank you. — Ezekiel000
Oops, edit conflict… Here's my reply anyway…
Ah, sorry, I should have been more explicit… If there is no iTunes link, for example, you leave the parameter in the SongFooter empty. Then you go to the talk page and change the iTunes parameter in the {{Song Info}} template to "not applicable". (A blank Song Info template will be created automatically when you first save the talk page.) I've done that now for 7 Year Itch (and its talk page), you can use them as examples.
PS. It takes a lot more than that to get banned. But we've had quite a few bouts of vandalism lately, which has led to some users getting warned for harmless and unintentional mistakes… Sorry for that. Us admins are only humans too. — 6x9 (Talk) 20:03, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

One 4 you...

Category:Language/Austro-Bavarian What's this guys problem? There's even a wikipedia link on that page. (Check his contributions too)  Яєdxx Actions Words 18:13, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

The main problem (maybe not from this guy's perspective, but from mine) is that we already have a well-populated Category:Language/Bavarian German – but the Wikipedia article for Bavarian German redirects to Austro-Bavarian… I also suspect that most pages in Category:Language/Austrian German should really be in Austro-Bavarian, while those that should be in AG are presently in C:L/German… I'd have to check the latter… (AG being the "official" language.) I'm no expert on dialects (the one I speak varies from one village to the next, and I doubt any living being could call itself an expert for it), and while Otto might be one, he's a bit too Jim-ish for my tastes… — 6x9 (Talk) 18:27, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Rflmao@Jim-ish. ish yes, but as we know Jim can't edit quietly. All I did was revert a few of his edits that came up on my watchlist and put a note on his talk page asking him not to change structure of cats without discussion. But you're the expert so I'll leave it in your very capable hands.  Яєdxx Actions Words 18:39, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Er, no, like I wrote above I'm no expert. (I guess at your age short-term memory isn't too reliable anymore…) So my solution would be to leave things as they are, until someone who knows (as opposed to knows better) comes along. — 6x9 (Talk) 18:52, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
He's moved onto fletter now..So where you going then? Anywhere nice? ;)  Яєdxx Actions Words 21:05, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Depends on your idea of nice :-) Far East. Moravia, near this town.6x9 (Talk) 21:11, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
I think we may ask otto to prove his language capabilities by translating the German National Anthem to every possible German dialect, and fixing all the Violet German songs, while Times is away studying his fav classical composers... ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 21:21, 10 April 2009 (UTC)not trying to make a mess before your trip...
Don't forget to set the alarm now you've told everyone when you're away ;). Enjoy your break and don't worry, we'll keep an eye on things.  Ñôīέ2çяȳTalk 22:08, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
Rfl@Echo  Яєdxx Actions Words 22:35, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
When people tell me not to worry, I usually start to worry :-) But thanks, I'm sure I will enjoy it. Unless there's another snowstorm…6x9 (Talk) 22:48, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Where Oh Where Oh Where is Shadow...?

I really can't see it...  Яєdxx Actions Words 01:05, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

If you're talking 'bout {{Album Art}}, that's because it's hidden inside an #if, so you can only see it if you use it. (Even the wikifyer adds it automatically!) — 6x9 (Talk) 01:09, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
I don't think I explained myself properly. Or perhaps Humbug's note on Sean's talk page just sparked off an idea in my head, but I'll try mucking about with template in my sandbox to see if I can improve this. Then you'll see what I mean.  Яєdxx Actions Words 01:50, 11 April 2009 (UTC) PS Have a nice trip.
[[Image:{{PAGENAME}} - {{{1}}}.jpg|180px|right|thumb|{{{1}}}]]  Яєdxx Actions Words 02:48, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
…will break all existing Album Art templates, with the FULL image name as first parameter. — 6x9 (Talk) 02:50, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
{{AlbumArt|Album name}}
EDIT CONFLICT: Don't know what you mean sorry.  Яєdxx Actions Words 02:54, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
If you want it to replace the current {{Album Art}}, you'd break all existing templates, as they would try to display "Image:PAGENAME - PAGENAME - Album name.jpg.jpg", since the full filename is present as first parameter. If you want a new AlbumArt template, then we'd have two templates for the same thing, which is unnecessary. So the proper procedure is to do it in a way that doesn't break the existing ones. — 6x9 (Talk) 02:57, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Yes that's what I thought you probably meant...EDIT CONFLICT: Unless you mean it's an absolutely brilliant idea but can't be done because too much burden on job queue/difficult to change existing templates.. Ah well. Is what I meant anyhow. So is that what Humbug meant then? Яєdxx Actions Words 03:01, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Dunno what Humbug meant, you'll have to ask him. But it is possible in a way that won't break the existing template. You have a week to figure it out :-) — 6x9 (Talk) 03:03, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Ok well surely there's got to be some code to say take the text between here (-) and here (.jpg) and chuck it out as caption?  Яєdxx Actions Words 03:05, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Cold, very cold. — 6x9 (Talk) 03:12, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Yeah right lol ;) Which reminds me..don't forget to pack your duffle coat (toggles...*shudders*)..or were you more the white (which didn't stay white for very long and ended up smelling of patchouli oil) afghan type?  Яєdxx Actions Words 03:19, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
White Afghan? I know Black Afghan, but that's not something you wear. And it doesn't smell of patchouli oil either. — 6x9 (Talk) 03:25, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
5th photo down.. I wouldn't fancy smoking one of them...they smelt pretty bad too..rfl  Яєdxx Actions Words 03:37, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Album Order

If albums come first, even if the compilation was released earlier does it carry foward that an EP would come first even if a soundtrack or compilation was released earlier? Also in the case of a song being released on an EP before an album, does the EP or album come first? Thank in advance Clichedgeek 04:17, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

If you are asking in what order to detail releases in {{Song}} template, the first appearance on studio album should go in first parameter. Up to two more releases can be added as album2 = and album3 = (and type2 = and type3 = respectively) and these should be added in chronological order. See here. Hope that helps.  Яєdxx Actions Words 04:27, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Essentially the page says that everything should be straight-up chronological. The only exception that I can think of that shouldn't come first is a Single release, as it is essentially released in conjunction with the album, even if it was released a few weeks before. (Which would only really come into play with the different years of release with a November/December single from a January/February album. Usually a song's appearance on a single isn't listed, anyway, just for the reason given earlier, that it's usually released in conjunction with an album.) Interesting case, though, appearing on a compilation album long before it was on the artist's own release.    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   04:57, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
Added point: I would reference the album by the artist, though, in the SongFooter, as was done, though.    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   04:58, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
The case that has lead me to ask the question was the track, Swing Life Away. It was recorded Punk Goes Acoustic (2003), which is a compilation, it then appeared on the Siren Song Of The Counter Culture (2004). I had them it chronological order but 6 times 9 changed it saying "albums come first, even if the compilation was released earlier". There is other cases with Rise Against like this for instance Rise Against:Obstructed View, after I saw 6 times 9's edit on the other song mentioned changed that one to the album first even when chronologically it is much newer. There is one or two other case where it happens with them as well and I just wanted to be sure before I adding albums to other tracks.Clichedgeek 05:28, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
An unusual case, one which I personally have not come across before. So just to be sure Kiefer, is the order now correct?  Яєdxx Actions Words 11:16, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
At least in the SongFooter, the first album should be entered, not a VA compilation, because some of the search links for the album also use the artist name (to narrow things down). If we ever want to remove all redundant parameters, SF would gather album information from the first album parameter in tl:Song, so that should be the first album by the band as well. — 6x9 (Talk) 12:23, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Former Home of The Party

The Cleaner was here. 03:01, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Thank you. I hope you folks don't expect me to pay him… — 6x9 (Talk) 09:43, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
The Cleaner missed a bit ;) And I don't know what's happened to that tall tree like plant you got in the hall, but it was fine when we was here (I asked it.)  Яєdxx Actions Words 03:09, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Album caps on song page


When I write the Album name into the song template, the problem is, that many times either the capping is correct, but it leads to the wrong page or the capping is wrong, but it leads to the correct page. Because the capping policy for page URLs is to always upper the first letter of each word and the song template only accepts one parameter for the album name, problems occur.

Example: Japanische Kampfhörspiele:Der Angriff Startet appears on the album Rauchen und Yoga. Writing Rauchen und Yoga (2007) makes the correct album capping appear, but it links to the wrong page. In contrast, writing Rauchen Und Yoga (2007) makes the wrong album capping appear, but it links to the correct page. (I posted an example at the bottom of the current Sandbox.)--KaputteMenschen 14:36, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

I am a little confused by this. But if understanded right, the correct capping is the one ie.
{{lw|Japanische Kampfhörspiele:Rauchen Und Yoga (2007)|Rauchen und Yoga (2007)}}
It was uncapped at the second parameter which shows the country's capping way. The first is the one that will be used for the link per LW policy. I hope I helped! Titaki 14:57, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
Thank you Titaki, yes you sure did. Capitalise The First Letter Of Each Word in Album Title to link song to album in {{Song}}.  Яєdxx Actions Words 16:40, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
Thank you both for your help! But I was looking more for something like the artist link display text method, but instead for albums. Capitalising the first letter of each word in the album title would lead to the correct page, but I'd also like to display the album name correctly.--KaputteMenschen 11:22, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
Sorry KaputteMenschen that isn't an option in {{Song}}.  Яєdxx Actions Words 01:51, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
We might add an option for this in the future – it would be a lot of extra hassle (since we'd need it for album2 and album3 as well), but necessary especially for albums with "forbidden" characters (like "#"). — 6x9 (Talk) 10:44, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

Shoot High, Aim Low

Something to aim for: Band Rels. Yes? ;) ES (Talk) 14:40, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

Ah, Pete Frame. His family trees are works of art. If you know him personally, you can try to persuade him to join :-) Unfortunately, I've never seen a HTML version that looked anywhere near as good. Would be great though. Do I have to mention the S-word? — 6x9 (Talk) 14:53, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
Well, I have a couple of books with a few of those diagrams (apparently all out of print for over 10 years). Last year someone wrote a (buggy) iTunes plugin that could generate something like that at band level, in addition to displaying lyrics and one's itunes music library, (with the source data coming from allmusic in real time, I think). Now since we have the necessary basis (related artist, credits) for generating those diagrams, maybe it's something to think about. As for the S word, see my entry at Community Portal/Upgrade ;) ES (Talk) 15:25, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
Do you have the one with the chart for Yes/Asia/half the prog rock bands that ever existed? I saw that once years ago and wish I had it now. I have no idea what book it was in, though, so I can't even search for it.    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   18:31, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
The book is called "The New Illustrated Rock Handbook", I have the 86 & 88 issues. Amazon has one 97 issue. There is one of Yes, Asia, ELP & The Nice. Lemme fire up the scanner... ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 19:10, 18 April 2009 (UTC) File:YES, ELP.etc.png
That chart is totally sick. There are dozens of other groups referenced, as well as at least three other family trees! And it stops in the mid-80s before many of the Yes members' side projects were done. Wow. Thanks, ES. I have quite a few used book stores in my area that I haven't been to in quite a while. I may have to go seeking again soon.    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   20:14, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
That one's relatively harmless. You should see the one for King Crimson. (I have a copy that came with the Frame by Frame box set.) Or this one for Camel, where every little bit of whitespace is filled out with small biographies… — 6x9 (Talk) 09:53, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Band Members Template

Further on to related artists

{{Band Members|role =artist name}}
{{Band Members
|Drums = Nick Mason
|Guitar = David Gilmour
|Bass = Roger waters
|Keyboards = Rick Wright

How's that look? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 11:21, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

What if there's two guitarists? Or three? Not to mention multi-instrumentalists. And members with no LW page that aren't likely to ever have one. And obscure instruments where we'd need to add a parameter just in case. We'll need such a template, if we ever want to make page ranking automatic which we could already do, BTW, Semantic or no, but it wouldn't reduce the amount of typing. It could be either
{{Members|{{lw|Nick Mason}} – drums|...}}
or (more sophisticated)
{{Members|o1={{lw|Syd Barrett}} – guitar, vocals|...|c1={{lw|Nick Mason}}...}}
where o1, o2 etc. would be original member, c1 etc. current member and f1 etc. former member (with subheaders). And we'd need to mark solo artists in some way, so their page won't complain about the absence of this template. — 6x9 (Talk) 11:46, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
All valid points as usual. Let's figure out what params each individual artist should have (on the Band page). DG played harmonica on 1 song, RW banged the Gong on occasion, a dawg did vocals on another song, do those bits belong on the song page, or the artist page? For the artist page, the primary instrument should suffice? Keyboards itself encompasses so many things beyond Organ/Piano. If the details for each band member does not fit a template and we want to give full details, then each band member can have their own page where those details can be organized.
The linking of the Band member name is what creates the relationship, whether the link is red or not, it's the link that adds value, not the color. A red linked artist with no releases to his name can still have valid relationships to many diff bands, and that's valuable information :) see Jon Carin & Bob Ezrin This also is not in conflict with whether or not the non releasing artist has a wiki page.
If you check the Ezrin page, you see that the only pages linking to it are PF pages that Will added him, but nobody bothered adding him to all the band pages were he was a non recording but contributing artist, so my short cut was to create the page and add his related artists. I am not suggesting that anyone should go and list Bob Ezrin for his role on every one of those artist/album/song pages where he contributed.
We can have a param in AH for non releasing artists, so we can categorize them as such. Then on his own page the non releasing artist can have full details on whatever is worthy enough to list. My thinking is that like the lrcdb param in AF, such template/pages is to be used only where it's applicable, as I think is the case of Bob & Jon. thoughts? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 13:15, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
Good point about the red links. The multiple guitarists etc. problem could be solved by having multiple parameters for each instrument… *light bulb appears above head* What about the following format?
This way we wouldn't have to provide a parameter for each instrument, and you could add as many instruments per artist as necessary (and even years for former/new members, or any additional info). — 6x9 (Talk) 13:42, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
Just so I can be clear in my head about this: what is the benefit of this template meant to be? I ask because it's beginning to sound like the template might end up being so complex due to the many variables that it might be off-putting to newbies and discourage editing. I had one time thought about such a thing being created (Oh, goodness, not by me though...!) but envisioned some of the same difficulties that are being brought up. If there was a good reason for creating this template as opposed to continuing with the status quo and manually typing the list (when it appears that much of the information that would have to be typed manually without the template would still have to be typed with the template), then I would certainly love to see what could be created. If there isn't a solid benefit to this that could overcome whatever challenges that using a template might create, then perhaps this isn't the best place to use a template.
I'm also not so sure what to think about the pages for those musicians that haven't released any solo work. Part of me likes it, but another part is concerned about what are essentially links to nowhere. Well, perhaps not nowhere, but when users click on an Artist link, they're expecting a discography and these pages are full of links to other artist pages. It's kind of an Artist disambiguation page, perhaps? These are musicians who we have in the past just been left link-less, or (for the more major musicians, I guess) linked to their Wikipedia even with a nice little WP icon so that users can know that they're going to an Encyclopedia-style page not an artist page with a discography. Now there's a new type of Artist page, one created for musicians with no releases. Does every musician get one of these, even if they have only been in one band? If not, then what will the cut off point be? Like I said, I'm a bit torn about this. Part of me likes it because the information is good to have, but I'm concerned about the possible repercussions.
Just some things for you guys to mull over. Keep talking about things, and when/if things get to a good point, bring it to the Comm. Portal for others feedback & ideas. Good luck!    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   02:55, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
Mmmm...I've also got reservations about all this. There have been so many changes that I feel our priorities should now be to try to get as many existing pages as possible up to scratch before implementing any further major changes. It also sounds like we will be expecting a lot more from our editors by implementing this and I'm not altogether sure that the benefits are worth all that this would involve. But like Kiefer says, bring it to the Community Portal to see what others think.  Яєdxx Actions Words 03:36, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
If we want band members to be mandatory for non-solo artists, and if we ever want to automate page ranking (which, like I wrote above, would be possible right now, though not without some major restructuring), then we'll need a template for this. The template itself would be somewhat complex, but not its usage (at least no more than the ones for labels, or genres, or related artists). — 6x9 (Talk) 10:32, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
I'd vote for members tl only provided that 6's really ready for Automatic Page Ranking. Then we'd need tl for Credits too. --Senvaikis (talk) 12:08, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Labels Template?

Is there a template for Label pages? -- Ezekiel000

Do you mean category pages? Or {{Labels}}  Яєdxx Actions Words 10:06, 20 April 2009 (UTC) P.S. Please sign your posts with ~~~~
The category pages, I didn't realise there were any other pages for labels. ezekiel000 10:16, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
No there isn't ;)I just wasn't sure I understood what you meant because with the exception of the {{wikipedia}} templates, we don't generally use templates on category pages.  Яєdxx Actions Words 10:21, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
Ok thanks. ezekiel000 10:26, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

What's up...

...with the TOC's in Community Portal? It wasn't like that last time I looked.  Яєdxx Actions Words 04:49, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

My bad… I added a clear to H1Fake. It's reverted now. — 6x9 (Talk) 12:19, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
I mucked up with it last week. I was beginning to think it had taken on a life of its own... energy transference  ;)  Яєdxx Actions Words 12:25, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

My Sig

Thank you for fixing my sig everywhere. I bow to your systematic thoroughness.    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   02:13, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Not everywhere – there's still lots of user talk pages left. It just became sort of a routine after I fixed those which Red had already fixed (so I could delete the clickpic template). Plus, it's actually less tedious than clearing out Special:WantedTemplates (which is mostly pages where users replaced the Song in {{Song}} with the song title). — 6x9 (Talk) 02:20, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Puff..He never thanked me..I've been correcting his signature on a daily basis since last upgrade *goes off to sulk* On a more serious note, it's a pity that Replace text extension Sean installed doesn't work.  Яєdxx Actions Words 02:34, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
I bow to your systematic thoroughness as well, Redxx. My apologies for the lateness of the patting of your back. Happy now? :-]    Kiefer    talk    contribs    admin   04:25, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Big Smile  Яєdxx Actions Words 11:25, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


You can make them bigger if you want, since it doesn't seem many (if any) are likely to be affected by pagesize (which is what I was thinking by making them all around 32kb)  Яєdxx Actions Words 15:00, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

I was thinking about consolidating them, also because otherwise the list might eventually get longer than the talk page itself… but after all the work you put into splitting them in the first place I thought you wouldn't be too happy about that. BTW, you needn't put __TOC__ on every archive page, since it's already in the template anyway. — 6x9 (Talk) 15:10, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Yes I thought as much (thank you for the consideration), but honest I only did it that way because I thought some users might have problems with page being bigger. I feel they would be better consolidated too.  Яєdxx Actions Words 17:30, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

A Grammar Question

Hi 6x9, I'd like your feeback on something. With Sean's blessing and his assistance, I changed the header on the German main page to read begrüßen Sie but I've had a couple of native German speakers give me conflicting advice. One says to leave it gender neutral, one says it should be Die and the other one said Das I figured I'd leave it alone and if you thought it needed Die or Das that you'll change it. Thanks! --    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   15:43, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Since "" is a (sort-of) name, it shouldn't have an article (like you wouldn't use "the Sean" either). I've changed the description.
However, "Begrüßen Sie LyricWiki" is kinda backwards: it tells people to welcome LW, not that they're welcome to LW… I fixed that too. (Both were created years ago, by Teknomunk and Frontway, and never edited since…) — 6x9 (Talk) 15:58, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

This is a bit weird...

Earth, Wind & Fire:In The Name Of Love (1997) I can't rid the page of the wrongly applied artwork. Why not?  Яєdxx Actions Words 17:29, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Because the correct artwork doesn't exist yet. If no image is specified, or if the specified image doesn't exist, {{Album}} uses the {{AlbumArtFinder}}. — 6x9 (Talk) 17:32, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Ok I best look at the template then, because the file was Various Artists - In The Name Of Love and the album wasn't a various artists compilation or a soundtrack but Earth, Wind & Fire - In The Name Of Love. Does it only go on album name then?  Яєdxx Actions Words 23:38, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Rfl Ok I looked at template ;) Then I closed the edit window..well it's been a long day ;)  Яєdxx Actions Words 23:41, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
(another edit conflict) See here. I've already made a note to fix this with the next revision (so it doesn't use VA if artist != VA). — 6x9 (Talk) 23:44, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
Aah..Ok thank you. I've not come across this problem til today. ..I hope you've got the beers in, because the crowd in CP will be arriving soon. Well, we can't celebrate St. George's Day without our favourite German, can we now? ;)  Яєdxx Actions Words 00:10, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Bavarian Schloss Codes

Schlösser, check them all if you will. 3 params is plenty. :) ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 23:20, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

I apologise if I've missed something, but if this is in connection with the Hometown discussion in CP Echo, which 6 is of course fully aware of, can I suggest you post this there. Thank you.  Яєdxx Actions Words 23:34, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
(edit conflict) For most countries two parameters are enough. Three are really only necessary if subcats + pages >> 200. I still don't see why we can't put Gibraltar & similar under UK while leaving England etc. as country. Or maybe Fragmented Kingdom instead… (I'll refrain from comments about monarchies in the 21st century.) — 6x9 (Talk) 23:37, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
If Times is going to insist that Bavaria becomes a Top level country, then we can't have Germany at the same level as Bavaria, just like we can't have California and United States both as countries, ergo, we can't have UK and NI at same level. UK contains England & Wales etc, Just like Germany contains Bavaria. Rural Bavarian boundaries don't belong in an international site. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 23:43, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


But I didn't think it was "old"..Isn't that the search Sean updated that now goes faster, etc..?  Яєdxx Actions Words 23:36, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Yes, but the name of the special page is still the same. I assume that's what Kingnee meant. Though it's possible of course that he missed the news about the upgrade…6x9 (Talk) 23:40, 23 April 2009 (UTC)


Sorry and thanks for the corrections. --Volund 17:31, 26 April 2009 (UTC)


Any magic yet to detect this: South Pacific:Happy Talk? cheers ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 19:47, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Already implemented in the sandbox version of SongFooter – it complains if there's no Song template present. Though that reminds me I still need to add a check for multiple Song templates… — 6×9 (Talk) 19:52, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
I take it from now on we will be using pagename parts for SH/SF artist and SF song. Can all song/album pages whose artist param in Header don't match artist from pagename be flatly listed in a category? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 20:10, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Still not possible, unfortunately (Sean is still waiting for the authors of the string extension to fix the performance issues, I think). New SF will at least use artist name from Song; can't use album, since there's no way yet to strip the last seven characters " (YYYY)". Currently your suggested category would contain all pages with semicolons in album/song title, which would rather limit its usefulness… — 6×9 (Talk) 20:16, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Yeah I wasn't sure if page name parts ...hopefully we'll get there. One more thing, detecting all artists besides CJK that need romanized, I know you're in Song land... Thanks ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 20:22, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Without being able to use ranges the only way to do that would be to list ALL characters from each non-Latin alphabet… which would make for a HUGE template. The only feasible way to find these artists is to go through each "Artists fLetter" category manually. — 6×9 (Talk) 20:29, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Sorry, that musta been the fourth time I asked that q. Thanks for the applied magic. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 20:32, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
One more thing, detection of duplicate SF, I have no clue why we have pages like that... ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 21:55, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Added a check for that. Though why anyone would add multiple SFs is beyond me… — 6×9 (Talk) 22:09, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

Batch Move Magic

Okay, so Echo mentioned to me that a song was wrongly attributed. I fixed that song page and when I went to what I thought would be the album page, instead I got an artist page. Long story short: I created Rogers and Hammerstein:South Pacific (1949) instead of Rogers And Hammerstein:South Pacific (1949). The songs themselves are all correct in that I moved them all one by one to Rogers And Hammerstein but the album page is actually Rogers and Hammerstein. Confused?    RainbowDragon    talk    contribs   21:32, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

I assume you're confused about the error message at the top? That looks like it's a new extension which Sean recently installed ("Implied Redirects", see here) which obviously doesn't quite behave like it should… I'll let him know. — 6×9 (Talk) 21:40, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
Erm, wait, you forgot a "d", the actual page is Rodgers and Hammerstein:South Pacific (1949)… What's the problem with that? You simply move it to "…And…" and either fix all links to it manually (there's only one, anyway) or let Janitor take care of that. — 6×9 (Talk) 21:44, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

lang aliases

check contribs by Problem with lang aliases is ppl put in ES/es/espanol, see it shows correctly in lang cat at bottom of song pages and they keep putting in abbreviations & non English versions. This will either get added to the long queue of bot jobs, or we just have to let it be entered any which way. Whenever we allow something to be done in multiple ways, somebody has to clean up other ppl's bad habits. something to ponder while I powder my emoticon's nose ;) and thanks for the SF dupe detector. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 00:14, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

I doubt it really works like that – I suspect most users put in whatever they think is correct and never bother to check if it actually is! (At least two Cat:Hometown/US(A) each week…) Like the guy who recently used half a dozen variations of Brazilian Portuguese on various song pages. (Except for Ignor who actively replaced "Portuguese" with "pt"; I hope I've cured him of that.) I can add a category "Invalid Language Parameter" though – this way we'd at least have them all in one place instead of having go through Wanted Categories regularly. — 6×9 (Talk) 00:27, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
German Bavarian wizardry! yes, make a cat for them. Too bad we can't show them a popup list of lang choices in edit mode. Which just reminds me, what does it take to make the song page in edit mode like a database form that one can tab from param to param with a big box for lyrics? far out, eh? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 00:33, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
*ahem* I'm most definitely not a Bavarian! Though I'm sure Red has some secret fantasies about me in Lederhosen…
Far out? That's way beyond the Kuiper belt! To do it natively would require some radical rewriting of the MW software, I should think… Maybe some sort of external frontend which would be loaded automatically for edit pages…
Any more debugging categories I should add to SF? Job queue is slowly but steadily creeping towards 0. (The next update might not be too far away, if Sean installs the string extension, or decides that SMW is viable after all.) — 6×9 (Talk) 00:48, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
Bavarian by IP anyway ;) I'm sitting here thinking, like you, what other things we can add during this update. Do we have any SF external links that use "http"? (hope not) How about detecting any instance of "http" anywhere on the page, sometimes it comes in via lyrics pasted from some sites that sneak in their address, etc. Another thing would be detecting any text whatsoever outside of the templates and outside of the lyrics box. Detecting Song/Artist/Albums on Song pages that disregard LW:PN? detecting stale beer? lol When do yoyu think you'll be putting all the latest & greatest into action? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 01:07, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
Trouble with templates is, they can only detect stuff inside templates (now, thanks to the variables extension, at least stuff inside other templates as well). There's no way to check what else is on a page. The only parameters in SF that need http are akuma (will be fixed) and download (can't strip the http from that – what if there's an ftp link somewhere? though we can probably rule out gopher). For youtube I've added a detector when a full link is used (since those contain slashes, I can use #titleparts for that). That's the only param. in SF where full URLs regularly crop up. (Other major offenders are myspace & WP in AH.)
The only way to catch URLs elsewhere on a page is the search function – I'd suggest leaving that until the ~64,000 akuma links have been converted, though! — 6×9 (Talk) 01:26, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Mine all mine!!

[1], do you do legal wizardry too? lol ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 01:22, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Uh-oh, hope she won't sue us! (← Please don't quote this without my permission!) — 6×9 (Talk) 01:29, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
You were quoted without your permission! She's back, see my talk page. My justification is that there is no proof that translation belongs to anyone, or copyrighted by any one. A request by artist to remove is another thing which we have dealt with before (lw removed the lyrics) but this case... you think pass it on to Sean? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 18:08, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
Might be best, just in case. I don't think she has any legal leverage though – I had a look at her site, and there's the usual blurb about "please don't use without permission" etc. but no contact address for her publishers :-) She also reproduces the original lyrics, but I doubt she asked the artists for permission… Hypocrisy much? — 6×9 (Talk) 18:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Multi SF bogus results?

see the cat, none that I see have more than 1 SF... ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 02:51, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

And none of them should be in there – neither of the ones I checked had the category listed at the bottom… Same with multiple song templates. Looks like #if and variables don't mix… — 6×9 (Talk) 02:58, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
I removed both cats. LOoked like they were going to fill up with every song page… Need to come up with a better solution for the next rev. Odd, though – I can understand a page listing a category at the bottom, but not appearing in said category (the usual lagging-behind bit), but vice versa??? — 6×9 (Talk) 03:04, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
Is there any way to test a template without putting it on lw? would you need to run your own wiki, or is there a wiki sandbox that you can run on your machine, I guess you are on Winduhs and wiki on Linux. In databases my solution is to test my code as script, debug the logic, then insert it in a routine/calc/procedure aka template once I know it's working. No worries, I won't sue ;) ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 03:14, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
The simple way to test a template is to put the sandbox version on a page and hit preview. Usually that's enough (unless you want to test things like category sortnames), so I didn't actually save a page to see what happened in Category Land. Which turned out to be a mistake… — 6×9 (Talk) 03:23, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
A mistake you will be encouraged to make when creating Cat:United Kingdom (still only United in my mind despite 700 years) lol ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 03:27, 27 April 2009 (UTC) sorry I forgot about Sandbox


Can you tell me why Cat lang English has lost over 100K pages and keeps shrinking? Are they going under Lang UK? ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 00:05, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

No idea… Maybe the inverse effect of that odd bug yesterday? Then pages appeared in a category though the category didn't appear on the pages, now maybe the category appears on the pages but the pages disappear from the category… I'm starting to think MW isn't really made to deal with complex templates. (Like the vanishing albums on WLH lists, though it seems I was able to fix that one, at least.) Or maybe the servers are having trouble keeping up and some stuff gets dropped when rebuilding pages – LW was rather sluggish in the last few hours. We might need to get Sean to run that touch-all-pages script once things are back to normal. — 6×9 (Talk) 00:25, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Explains why SNLI lost over 2000 pages overnight as well and still shrinking too. English was ~525,000 before before the new SF went into effect. This sounds like where we were last year. Doesn't seem to be affecting fLetter cats, so why only language? I am certain Sean is reading this, He's probably waiting for either the job queue or English to hit zero. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 01:42, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
I'm wondering about the JQ anyway… the last time I updated S + SF it went up past 1 million and took a week to get back to 0, now it's been around 170,000 for hours and only slowly shrinking. That can't be right somehow. Guess I chose a really bad time for the update… — 6×9 (Talk) 01:49, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Does lang/SNLI detection go thru the lang alias table for every page? (case of template depending on sub template). How can we test that absence of artist in SF may have caused any problems?, iTunes songs doesn't seem to be shrinking? Your observations on JQ curve & max matches what I see, and yes response time is slow since S/SF update. Maybe the server is just slowly melting ;) ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 02:03, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
It does for every page that has the language parameter filled in (and no instrumental template). Maybe next time I'll add an #ifexist and bypass it if true… Absence of artist should make no difference at all category-wise, since it's only used for external search links and not for any categories. LW was slow before the update too, at one time yesterday the JQ was stuck at ~4000 for hours… Maybe I should have seen that as a warning. I hope by the time Sean finds out my address he's calmed down a bit :-) — 6×9 (Talk) 02:19, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Oddly enough, Lang/E seems to shrink faster than the job queue. Just the sort of thing you'd expect from a site set up by Mister C. — 6×9 (Talk) 02:41, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Spanish is going down too. Category:Language/Instrumental is down to 12000, (it is supposed to disappear, right?). I was thinking about the logic of language detection too, the inclusion in SNLI seems to switch on a song page if there is two lang params one filled and one unfilled, depending on which one is first on template. My logic would If (lang = "sometext", check "sometext" against alias table then set Cat Lang sometext, else SNLI). I think checking how 'if exists' differs from 'if true' depending on empty param, filled param & no param would give some ideas. I do recall coming across this problem in non lw context. Also checking exactly how Instrumental detector removes a song from lang detection may be another area (but Cat Instru isn't getting chubbier, lol). Maybe the JQ was redirected to Lang/English and they will all come out with an England flag a-waving for lang? Keep your eyes on the white cliffs of Dover ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 03:22, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
(Quick test) Yep, second parameter listing overrides first, even if empty. Unfortunately there's no way for the template to detect double params. Current setup is: (1) check for language variable (set by tl:Instrumental), if found ignore language altogether; if not – (2) check language parameter – if non-empty, run it through switcher and return whatever comes out, if empty put song in SNLI. (In future the switcher could be bypassed by seeing first if category exists for given parameter. That would probably put less strain on the servers.)
How well Instrumental detector works will come out once the JQ is through – the only pages left in C:L/I should then be those with language=Instr, but no Instr template. (So far it seems to do its job.) — 6×9 (Talk) 03:41, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Pages show in cat, but...

...category is empty. All the pages at Category:Pages Using Hometown Template have the "Pages Needing Artist Header" link at the bottom, but PNAH is empty, I had noticed it earlier when Janitor created the last batch of Artists with HT template, but thought it's gonna go away once the artist pages are updated. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 11:47, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Category:Songs SONGFLETTER was empty until yesterday, now they're all coming out of the woods. — 6×9 (Talk) 14:15, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Adding up all songs in Cat:Songs fLetter I get 664,836, for all songs in Cat:Language/… it's 451,726 (plus the 11,569 in SNLI and a couple thousand in Cat:Instr that show no longer in Cat:Lang/Instr). So there's about 200,000 songs missing. — 6×9 (Talk) 14:22, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
(thanks for the update & edit conflict ;) I worked on (SongsfLetter) since the beginning when it was 250, it was 160 two days ago, I have pages open for a few cats all the time. I caught 15 out of invalid lang param tonight, we'll see if more shows up. Unless Sean is going to run the Category update/touch script, we need a bot to remove SF-artist + fix akuma which will fix the cat problems too (by virtue of the edit) unless you think it's best to wait till August when the lang cats will come back to reality. The whole point of having Lang cats/ids is being lost, but not the filled params, thankfully. ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 14:32, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Category:LyricWiki talk archives

Another reason to amalgamate....?

But in view of this (and thinking ahead), what I'd like to do is remove the categorisation from the {{ArchNav}} to prevent each archive page appearing in this category. However, I would still like to ensure (without having to do this manually) that the archive index page shows up in this category (and likewise in the other similarly named categories) when ArchNav is used on the sub pages to which the archive index relates.

Also, something needs amending on {{Archive}} because this page should be in Category:LyricWiki talk archives, not Category:LyricWiki archives.

So.. have you got your wand to hand? Or can I purchase a spell?

Oh and...

Multi-Platinum Record The Multi-Platinum Record
6x9, I hereby present you with this Multi-Platinum Record for all the work you put into improving the site. We are lucky to have you amongst us!

Yeah well that is how I feel most of the time. But I gotta say that there has been the odd that time last week...and not forgetting the week before when...

 Яєdxx Actions Words 00:22, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

P.S. and one day I'll have to amalgamate all my award templates into just the one..

Thanks, I think… though I feel the same way, so I guess that's only fair ;-)
Done {{Archive}}. Not sure about ArchNav though – aren't all pages supposed to be categorised, ideally? And even if a category grows past 200, you slap a CatAZ on it and that's that. — 6×9 (Talk) 14:12, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for correcting that. And yes, all pages should be categorised did kinda occur to me after I posted that. It just looks so messy in there. Perhaps I just shouldn't look in there :-)
Oh and unrelated I know, but I've updated the Help page in relation to the new I'm-getting-used-to-it (and-might-even-come-to-like-it) Instrumental template. I also amended the bit about completing language parameter too. Probably lots more updating to do in view of your recent changes (maybe we should slow down a bit now to catch up with ourselves) but I figure every little helps :-)  Яєdxx Actions Words 14:38, 29 April 2009 (UTC)


look at your sentence again. Would you word it any differently next time?  Яєdxx Actions Words 14:59, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

And you complain about Echo being too cryptic sometimes? — 6×9 (Talk) 15:02, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
Me? Cryptic? not! ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 15:41, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
I think the solution to that particular riddle might be here. I suggest we delete the whole lot of them. — 6×9 (Talk) 15:50, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
No, I suggest we keep the longer ones... ∃cho⚡ierr∀ ( ) 15:54, 29 April 2009 (UTC) ducking & riunning
"Archives: some say size matters, others say it doesn't... wish they'd make up their mind already"...that sentence...  Яєdxx Actions Words 02:12, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
And why should I want to word that any differently? — 6×9 (Talk) 02:15, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
It's a tense thing. Future/present = "wish they would make up their mind.." (plural = almost got a freebie there - lol) and the last word "already". Already = past tense. Now I know you're German ;)  Яєdxx Actions Words 14:53, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
Tense? Get a massage then. And someone who can't spell "liner notes" or tell "its" and "it's" apart (and I'm almost sure that, if I looked hard enough, I'd probably find a "would of" somewhere) is really not in a position to give me English lessons. (And then there's your repeated use of "you was" instead of "you were"… Need I go on?) — 6×9 (Talk) 15:00, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
Hee hee. No, I can assure you that you would've never found a "would of". But you are right. My finger does slip occasionally causing it to appear that I don't know about possesive pronouns and using apostrophe's for abbreviations/missing letters.
Now, I was going to argue the toss with you over the whole you was/you were thing, and then .... Somehow, I don't envisage that I shall be "you was"ing quite so frequently anymore... :-) Яєdxx Actions Words 15:30, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
"…using apostrophe's…" *tee hee* — 6×9 (Talk) 15:45, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
Duh!! Rflmao, he told me he was a possessive pronoun ;) *does a quick grammatical check*  Яєdxx Actions Words 15:57, 1 May 2009 (UTC)


now why did you revert this? these songs were listed twice -- 17:43, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

You redirected the correctly titles pages to the incorrectly titled ones, so I restored them. — 6×9 (Talk) 18:08, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
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